This is taken from a thread I participated in a few years ago, I didn't write this, this was a response
Setting Boundaries The purpose of setting boundaries is to take care of our self. Being forced to learn how to set boundaries is a vital part of learning to own our self, of learning to respect ourselves, of learning to love ourselves. If we never have to set a boundary, then we will never get in touch with who we really are - will never escape the enmeshment of codependence and learn to define ourselves as separate in a healthy way.
When I first encountered the concept of boundaries, I thought of them as lines that I would draw in the sand - and if you stepped across them I would shoot you (figuratively speaking.) (I had this image of some place like the Alamo - from a movie I guess - where a sword was used to draw a line in the sand, and then those that were going to stay and fight to the death stepped across it.) I thought that boundaries had to be rigid and final and somehow kind of fatal.
Some boundaries are rigid - and need to be. Boundaries such as: "It is not OK to hit me, ever." "It is not acceptable to call me certain names." "It is not acceptable to cheat on me."
No one deserves to be treated abusively. No one deserves to be lied to and betrayed.
We all deserve to be treated with respect and dignity. If we do not respect ourselves, if we do not start awakening to our right to be treated with respect and dignity (and our responsibility in creating that in our lives) - then we will be more comfortable being involved with people who abuse us then with people who treat us in loving ways. Often if we do not respect ourselves, we will end up exhibiting abusive behavior towards people who do not abuse us. On some level in our codependence, we are more comfortable with being abused (because it is what we have always known) than being treated in a loving way.
Learning to set boundaries is vital to learning to love our self, and to communicating to other's that we have worth.
There are basically three parts to a boundary. The first two are setting the boundary - the third is what we will do to defend that boundary.
If you - a description of the behavior we find unacceptable (again being as descriptive as possible.)
I will - a description of what action you will take to protect and take care of your self in the event the other person violates the boundary.
If you continue this behavior - a description of what steps you will take to protect the boundary that you have set.
One very drastic example (in the case of someone who is just learning about boundaries and has been physically abused in the past) would be:
If you ever hit me, I will call the police and press charges - and I will leave this relationship. If youcontinue to threaten me, I will get a restraining order and prepare to defend myself in whatever manner is necessary.
It is not always necessary or appropriate to share the third part of this formula with the other person when setting a boundary - the first two steps are the actual setting of the boundary. The third part is something we need to know for ourselves, so that we know what action we can take if the other person violates the boundary. If we set a boundary and expect the other person to abide by it automatically - then we are setting ourselves up to be a victim of our expectation.
It is not enough to set boundaries - it is necessary to be willing to do whatever it takes to enforce them. We need to be willing to go to any length, do whatever it takes to protect ourselves. This is something that really upset me when I first started learning how to set boundaries. It took great courage for me to build myself up to a point where I was willing to set a boundary. I thought that the huge thing I had done to set a boundary should be enough. Then to see that some people just ignored the boundaries I had set, seemed terribly unfair to me. (This page includes quotes from Codependence: The Dance of Wounded Souls and quotes from other articles, columns, or web pages (indented) written by Robert Burney.)
I had to learn that boundaries are internal, they are NOT "behavioral modification"
They are for me, not the other person, boundaries are for when the OTHER person doesn't change, not to get them to change, that part caused me grief for decades
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
I say 'when' & if I'm not happy, I can make a decision for my own behaviour & I take care of myself by carrying it out. So, they're not dependent on me & I'm not dependent upon them. I can choose freedom & I have the freedom to choose as do others.
I am still learning about boundaries and when it's ok to set them. What do I do when, in order to enforce my boundary with my ex-husband, I cause pain for my son? My ex is a chronically depressed person, and very often doesn't follow through on things he has agreed to do. When we were married, I made up for his not doing things by my doing everything for him. I won't do that anymore.
But lately, as my son is spreading his wings and wanting to get more involved in activities outside of school, my ex has refused to drive my son to those activities on the days when our son is at his house (we have an even 50-50 split of days). My boundary is, I don't make up for my ex's laziness, so I tell my son if he can't get a ride from his dad, then he's just not going to be able to go. Is that fair of me? How do I make clear to my son that I support his right to be involved in activities, but I won't have a fight with his dad to get him to drive his son?
I am still learning about boundaries and when it's ok to set them. What do I do when, in order to enforce my boundary with my ex-husband, I cause pain for my son? My ex is a chronically depressed person, and very often doesn't follow through on things he has agreed to do. When we were married, I made up for his not doing things by my doing everything for him. I won't do that anymore.
This is where we enter the world of blurred crossover between boundaries and not enabling and behavior modification for me
A boundary, as I understand it is to protect me from another persons harmful behavior, we don't put boundaries on other peoples yards, so I think this is a case of "not enabling"as opposed to "setting a boundary"
But lately, as my son is spreading his wings and wanting to get more involved in activities outside of school, my ex has refused to drive my son to those activities on the days when our son is at his house (we have an even 50-50 split of days). My boundary is, I don't make up for my ex's laziness, so I tell my son if he can't get a ride from his dad, then he's just not going to be able to go. Is that fair of me? How do I make clear to my son that I support his right to be involved in activities, but I won't have a fight with his dad to get him to drive his son?
I think that sounds about right, but it's your son that suffers, I don't have any experience with co-parenting so I have nothing to offer in this specific situation, except I think -not- enabling your husband and co-signing his bools**t is a good idea, but I truly can't offer anything specific, since the giving of advice is what we are to here to recover from LoL, but this particular situation ... I'd find someone who co-parents and ask them what they did
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
My take would be that your son's relationship with his Dad is independent of you. It is between them. If you want to take your son, that's your business & you can do as much for him as you can & want to do but there is no sense arguing with anyone. The argument, if there is any, is between your boy & his Dad. You can make your suggestion, do what you're going to do & leave it at that. If your ex won't take his son he can have the consequences of that in their relationship. It's not about you arguing but saying what you can & won't do without it being a tug of war or you 'making up for his Dad's responsibilities'. I would say it comes down to a practicality at the end of the day & it's principles before personalities. Does this make sense? What do you think?
My take would be that your son's relationship with his Dad is independent of you. It is between them. If you want to take your son, that's your business & you can do as much for him as you can & want to do but there is no sense arguing with anyone. The argument, if there is any, is between your boy & his Dad. You can make your suggestion, do what you're going to do & leave it at that. If your ex won't take his son he can have the consequences of that in their relationship. It's not about you arguing but saying what you can & won't do without it being a tug of war or you 'making up for his Dad's responsibilities'. I would say it comes down to a practicality at the end of the day & it's principles before personalities. Does this make sense? What do you think?
Zigackly
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it's not the change that's painful, it's the resistance to change that is painful
Wow- this is all so helpful! I can draw a clearer map for my son with these ideas. I've been trying to educate him about how he can approach his dad, but I didn't really have all the lines clear in my mind before.
LinBaba wrote:
"the giving of advice is what we are to here to recover from,"
I am a co-parent and I think I have another take on this question. My ex is an active alcoholic and not responsible, i.e. he will say he'll do things and then he won't, etc. I was complaining to my therapist once about this. "I'm doing all this stuff he should be doing!" I said. "I'm picking up the slack for him! I'm doing all this work for him!" "No," she said, "You're doing all this work for your child."
It's a sad fact that those of us without responsible partners will end up doing more than 50% of the work of trying to give our children healthy, safe, happy childhoods. Those are the cards we've been dealt, and the way I see it, if we refuse, we're not harming our spouse, we risk harming the child.
One of the (many) reasons I got out of my marriage was the effect my husband's unreliability was having on our son, whose life was being disrupted by broken promises and his dad not letting him be the kid and the dad be the dad. It was heartbreaking to see our son trying to get his dad to honor his promises, getting all excited about something and then realizing his father had forgotten it or didn't think it was important, and so forth. When I left the marriage I wanted to protect him from that, so I don't want to send him out with his dad and have the same thing happen all over again. An adult can cope with the irresponsibility of another adult, but I don't think a kid should feel he has to cajole and manipulate his parent into being the adult. That's the kid being in the responsible role and the adult being the kid.
What the solution is exactly depends on so many variables. I think if I were in this exact situation, I might do something like a ride exchange where another parent picks up your kid from his dad's house and takes him to the activity, and you take both kids some other time in the week. That's the kind of thing it takes an adult to arrange. (I remember trying to arrange something like this when I was ten, because my own parents weren't responsible enough to get me rides to places I needed to go. It was miserable. No one would take a kid seriously.) Or maybe he visits his dad only on days he doesn't have any activities he needs to go to. Or maybe you can sit down and talk out the options with him together.
It's a tough situation. Take what you like and leave the rest -- the best to you.
